Li These people are desperate, CPS cannot find the evidence they need, so now they want the people to "confess their sins?"
Gees LC, all I was saying is your post and facts you mentioned are inconclusive to draw a opinion from . It came across to me you were basing all your facts on half that would be needed to form a fair opinion .
A little something else , your post sounded as if you were trying to influence others on half the story . I got a confession for you LC , I hate and despise half stories whether you , CPS or anyone else who puts them out intentionally.
Now I'm not some kind of blog referee by no means , but if a person wants to loose any credibility they might other wise have coming I'd suggest being a little more forthright and not high grade info you're looking to sell as a complete deal .
| QUOTE |
| I know far more what is happening with this people then you do. |
OK , you most likely do , so tell me more of what I don't know , you know , the stuff that all the media is failing to say . Yup , tell me the inside skinny on things .
Self Proclaimed Greatness
16th May 2008 - 01:50 PM
| QUOTE (1 yankie @ May 16 2008, 11:35 AM) |
OK , you most likely do , so tell me more of what I don't know , you know , the stuff that all the media is failing to say . Yup , tell me the inside skinny on things . |
The skinny. . . . . is what is dismissed out of hand. These are, for the most part, good people. True, Warren's got their heads in a cloud, but that can be fixed. I'm not a mother, but I can imagine lying to save my children. Aside from that, I find it VERY hard to lie. I might not always give all the details to cover my ass, but who does. But if you ask me outright, I would rather tell you the truth or tell you to back off then to lie to you.
These people are much like me. Lying is hard for them, but like I said, to save a child, I'd do it.
But if simply if Jim can just post the nasty stuff about them, I'm not going to feel overly bad about pointing out the nice things. Everyone that knows me understands how upset I am at some of the actions of these people. I have suffered disappointment in some of my uncles that are members of this group. But as a whole, their honor and trustworthiness stands tall above your average Joe.
Hearing them being called liars, when hundreds of reports about CPS lying are flooding out by journalists who are unbiased upsets me. These are honorable people. I am upset what they have done with the Lost Boys and some other situations, but I am not in their shoes. I believe they have some faulty ideas, but straighten them out a little and anyone of them is damn near saintly with their honesty, fairness, respect, kindness, love, and trustworthiness. Hundreds and thousands of people that are for the first time dealing with them are confirming what I just said. CPS on the other hand has thousands of people reporting how nasty, lying, cruel, disrepectful, even hateful they are.
I'm not going to sit around and relate how this Barlow boy, or that Jessop pissed me off once or twice when they have had their children stolen from them. And if you think I've given you half truthes in an effort to hide their sins, then I'm just as insulted. I'm done as much or more to expose these peoples' wrongs as the next guy, but nothing they've done, that I know of, deserves this. Their sin is spiritual in the sense they listened to a megalomanic self-acclaimed prophet that twisted up their families and clouded their minds. But even so, they are bright and clean souls. They are not the lying pedophiles that everyone is so ready to paint them. They are some, yes, but even they are simply victims of their low self-esteem. Such men are everywhere, in every neighborhood, in every school, probably driving your child's school bus.
But these people have done very well considering the "ignoring" the government has "allowed them" over the years.
You can disrespect me all you want, I've never lied to anyone here, and I've been a whole lot more open to other perspective most here. I've allowed and admitted that these people not perfect, but all I hear is self-righteous BS about how they abusers and pedophiles and such when I know that same things are going on in your own communities. But NOT ONE of you guys have moved or conceeded that you're not as perfect as you like to make yourselves. No, it's the Pligs that are lying, not CPS. No, even though the phone call was a hoax and no charges have been filed, we're still going to make these women and children prove that they are not abusers.
Yank, you've really pissed me off saying that I've been telling half stories. As far as I'm concerned, I'm one only one here willing to look at both sides.
Cactus Jim
16th May 2008 - 02:25 PM
QUOTE (Self Proclaimed Greatness @ May 16 2008, 01:50 PM)
These people are much like me. Lying is hard for them, but like I said, to save a child, I'd do it.
CPS is having problems finding out who is a related to whom and how old they are because most of them are lying through their teeth about very aspect, just as they've always done. . These are lying Mormons just like they've been back to when Joseph Smith was lying to the world about practicing polygamy. To their minds, they are just "Lying for the lord". Any crime or sin is justified for them. They put children to work and lie about their ages. Kids are taught from a young age to lie about who their daddy is. Theylie to each other about how happy they are. They lie to business associates, they lie to government officials, they lie to journalists, they lie to the public. They are nothing but liars. Lying to them comes about as hard as breathing.
| QUOTE |
| As far as I'm concerned, I'm one only one here willing to look at both sides. |
Really? When have you described how CPS has taken these kids out of an isolated abusive comminity and done them a huge favor in the process? You are nothing but a polyg apologist.
1 yankie
16th May 2008 - 09:02 PM
QUOTE (Self Proclaimed Greatness @ May 16 2008, 01:50 PM)
The skinny. . . . .
| QUOTE |
| Yank, you've really pissed me off saying that I've been telling half stories. As far as I'm concerned, I'm one only one here willing to look at both sides. |
Well I don't know what to say to you LC. However I understand your position in someways . For the most part people have been saying negative things towards the FLDS and I suppose feeling like you must you kinda have to act as a balancing or equal time kind of a person most of the time around here .
Its hard to be impartial when your interests are at hand . To me I've tried to look at both sides as fair as I suppose a person can be . But for me what I see is a culture completely out of balance , maybe their heads are in the clouds as you say , but what ever the cause be it Jeffs or polygamy there are some serious problems and issues someones got to face .
One of those things you must face are the problems coming from the FLDS are not going to fix themselves as long as people view Jeffs as a prophet . Do you really think the FLDS people could survive close to 30 more years of Warren should he live as long as his father did ? Can you imagine this possibility if the FLDS were just left alone ?
I understand that the removal of these children bother you and it should , but maybe not that it was done but why it was done . Why were these children taken LC ? Was it to punish and persecute the FLDS by ignorant uncaring people who do not understand your culture? Who had the power to do so and they did ?
Maybe you feel this way , there are many would agree with this after these children were removed . But do these other people know as much of the ills of your culture as you do ? I'm choosing right now not to talk about the downward spiral that Jeffs accelerated greatly , you know what I could mention and how unconscionable some of these acts have been .
So I ask you , would you rather have Jeffs deeds continual or stopped ? I think this is the balancing of reality you need to work out . Right now all your focus seems to be on these mothers and children separated from each other over this last month .
I kinda think if you were to consider how things were when you were a kid under Johnson , how things are now with Jeffs and what very well could happen if this pattern isn't stopped you'd realize your culture you love so much is being taken from you from the inside .
Just something to think about , I have , no I doubt it will ease you mind about the mother and children separation , However I think you will realize if Jeffs and crew were just left alone unchecked things would only get worse for all . Both inside your culture and outside . If a raid had to happen to--" fix "--the FLDS --, well then maybe now is better than later I would have to say . What about you LC, what do you say , if a raid was bound to happen again , isn't now better than later ?
Self Proclaimed Greatness
19th May 2008 - 08:36 AM
| QUOTE |
| Well I don't know what to say to you LC. However I understand your position in someways . For the most part people have been saying negative things towards the FLDS and I suppose feeling like you must you kinda have to act as a balancing or equal time kind of a person most of the time around here . |
Yank, I don’t think I have to act a certain way. I’m your basic response of someone irritated and violated. Don't mind me. I don’t suppose that either one of us has anything to gain by being pissed off at each other, I don’t. Sometimes the “spirit” takes me and I get a little pissy.
My message doesn’t change here. The people have been neglected. To say they “can’t” fix it by themselves is sort of silly. Why should they? They are Americans, they should have the rights and access to the courts without fear of their religion or lifestyle. But because of the what I perceive as self-righteousness the courts will not hear their cases without jumping into matter that should be left out.
My brother was pulled over one-day for speeding. When the officer realized where he was from, he said, “I suppose the first question I should ask is how many wives do you have?” He was joking, of course, gave the speeding ticket and went on his way. But that is how we feel. Oh, you want to sure your neighbor for damages, how many wives do you have?’
You can’t stop Warren, even if you shot him. My culture was taken from me when I quit belonging to it. I was part of the CP group and never had anything to do with Warren.
Raiding isn’t going to “fix” anything. It never did.
Self Proclaimed Greatness
21st May 2008 - 01:59 PM
9 down 17 to go
Oh the horror!!
And one was 28 years old.
Self Proclaimed Greatness
22nd May 2008 - 10:37 AM
http://www.religionnewsblog.com/21502/half...declared-adults15 of the 31 admitted adults.
One of the 31 pregnant teens (age 14) turns out to have not been pregnant or have a child.